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Netduino Mini not playing nicely with SAM-BA 2.15

Started by kiwi65, Apr 09 2015 07:54 AM

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#1 kiwi65

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Posted 09 April 2015 - 07:54 AM

I’ve run into a wall attempting to upgrade my Netduino Mini from NetMF 4.1 to 4.2.

 

I've learned that the bootloader will need to be updated before upgrading from NetMF 4.1. I learned I’ll need to use SAM-BA to install the bootloader, and I can only flash the Mini over its RS232 serial interface (not its TTL interface)

 

The theory’s great, but things seem to come unstuck for me when I try to use SAM-BA.

 

I followed these setup steps:

  1. Completely reset the Mini with 5v to the tiny reset pad for ~1 second. 
     
  2. My laptop does not have native serial RS232 so I’ve set up for the bootloader flash with a USB->RS232 FTDI breakout board. Board RX connected to Mini TX. Board TX connected to Mini RX. Board Gnd connected to Mini Gnd. My setup looks pin perfect to Frode’s.
     
  3. Powered up the Mini with 9v to pin24 and Gnd to pin23. The obligatory breadboard LED glows to confirm that I had indeed provided power to the device
     
  4. Checked all the COM settings were good, 115200 8 N 1
     
  5. Run SAM-BA 2.15, selected the FTDI-presented COM port (the only COM port listed), selected AT91SAM7X512-EK, and hit Connect

There’s a flurry of TX/RX traffic on the FTDI LEDs and then SAM-BA returns a dialog titled “Invalid Chip ID”. I get the same dialog when any AT91 device is selected in step 5.

 

Thinking that my Mini could be dead, I lifted it from the ZIF socket and tried again – checking the RX/TX LEDs. This time there was no RX traffic, which I’ve interpreted as meaning the Mini is alive and can respond to SAM-BA when I click the Connect button.

 

I’ve googled until Chrome shows every  relevant link in purple (been there, read that!).. so now I’m kinda stuck.

 

I’d be stoked to hear anyone’s wisdom on this topic. Thanks in advance!


#2 Dr Who

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 04:49 PM

I’ve run into a wall attempting to upgrade my Netduino Mini from NetMF 4.1 to 4.2.

 

I've learned that the bootloader will need to be updated before upgrading from NetMF 4.1. I learned I’ll need to use SAM-BA to install the bootloader, and I can only flash the Mini over its RS232 serial interface (not its TTL interface)

 

The theory’s great, but things seem to come unstuck for me when I try to use SAM-BA.

 

I followed these setup steps:

  1. Completely reset the Mini with 5v to the tiny reset pad for ~1 second. 
     
  2. My laptop does not have native serial RS232 so I’ve set up for the bootloader flash with a USB->RS232 FTDI breakout board. Board RX connected to Mini TX. Board TX connected to Mini RX. Board Gnd connected to Mini Gnd. My setup looks pin perfect to Frode’s.
     
  3. Powered up the Mini with 9v to pin24 and Gnd to pin23. The obligatory breadboard LED glows to confirm that I had indeed provided power to the device
     
  4. Checked all the COM settings were good, 115200 8 N 1
     
  5. Run SAM-BA 2.15, selected the FTDI-presented COM port (the only COM port listed), selected AT91SAM7X512-EK, and hit Connect

There’s a flurry of TX/RX traffic on the FTDI LEDs and then SAM-BA returns a dialog titled “Invalid Chip ID”. I get the same dialog when any AT91 device is selected in step 5.

 

Thinking that my Mini could be dead, I lifted it from the ZIF socket and tried again – checking the RX/TX LEDs. This time there was no RX traffic, which I’ve interpreted as meaning the Mini is alive and can respond to SAM-BA when I click the Connect button.

 

I’ve googled until Chrome shows every  relevant link in purple (been there, read that!).. so now I’m kinda stuck.

 

I’d be stoked to hear anyone’s wisdom on this topic. Thanks in advance!

 

Hello!

First things first. Did you follow everything in that thread? I bumped, and hard as well, into the same issue with mine. I found that it would need to be power-cycled and that means to turn the board off, wait a few moments, and turn it back on. Then follow the deployment steps.

 

Incidentally the Wiki describes exactly how the tool is supposed to be configured, also that you're supposed to connect to it, the Mini via an RS232 connection. Since most modern systems do not have them that means we need to use proper Serial from USB adapters, and oddly enough FTDI makes the proper chip for that. You then need an adapter who embodies that design. Oddly enough a company in California (USA) makes an adapter for that purpose, normally useful for programming their devices who still use Serial as a deployment method.

 

Here are the links for the adapters:

https://www.parallax.com/product/28031 (That one has the working cable enclosed.)

 

https://www.parallax.com/product/28030 (That one does not have the working cable enclosed.)

 

Depending on where you are based, a store front firm named Micro Center sells the first entry directly. They are also recognized sellers for NetDuino devices which I find supportive. They also sell Parallax items and even those dratted things which our hosts based the shape of the others on. 

 

The reason why I'm pushing the use of those items is that the adapter you chose, which is a breakout board probably designed by Sparkfun, translates the signals into TTL levels, a second chip, which is a MAX232 chip translates them into those idiotic RS232 voltage levels. Frode's idea may have used one that they make which coincidentally is functionally equivalent to the two I name, (The FTDI company that is.) The SPFE breakout board which I use here also, is just the front end, the MAX232 does the heavy lifting and the final voltage translation.

 

So in conclusion to completely solve your problems you need to be using either of those two adapters, and then a DB9 connector connected to it, and the appropriate pins connected to the Mini, which is an easy summary. 

 

And more important is that the photo he supplied, doesn't show the full features behind the adapter he chose. So I've provided both. (I have both here. One was bought before the other.)

 

Incidentally Chris you can pay me Tuesday for the reply today.



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#3 kiwi65

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Posted 12 April 2015 - 10:35 PM

Dr Who, thanks for your suggestions. And good to know someone else has had (and solved!) the same problem.

 

I did spend some time finding a USB serial that claimed to be RS232 rather than TTL. If I wasn't an amateur I'd get a scope [which I don't have] and test it [which I don't know how to do]  :D

 

I've just received a new Sparkfun cable (https://nicegear.co....s232-converter/) and a DB9 connector + breakout board. Will build those up today and give it another go.


#4 kiwi65

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Posted 13 April 2015 - 01:14 AM

Ok, some progress. The cable+db9+breakout seems has worked. I've carefully, and successfully followed  the TinyBootloaderDecompressor installation steps, right down to:

 

 

 

"After that we can close the SAM-BA tool and test if it's actually done."

 

So I close SAM-BA, disconnect the USB->DB9 cable from my laptop, power down the Mini, wait 5 seconds, power up the Mini, re-connect the USB cable->DB9 cable and run MSDeploy (4.3.1.0). I then select Device to 'USB' and expect "Netduino_Netduino" to be found and displayed as per the Wiki steps... but the Device name field remains empty, and Ping returns nothing. 

 

I've tried variations on this, not power cycling the Mini, changing the order of the power/connect steps etc... but have concluded that either the TineBootloaderDecompressor installation failed, or I installed the wrong TinyBootloaderDecompressor.bin file (I used this one: attachment)

 

Appreciate any further help.


#5 Dr Who

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Posted 13 April 2015 - 03:36 PM

Ok, some progress. The cable+db9+breakout seems has worked. I've carefully, and successfully followed  the TinyBootloaderDecompressor installation steps, right down to:

 

 

So I close SAM-BA, disconnect the USB->DB9 cable from my laptop, power down the Mini, wait 5 seconds, power up the Mini, re-connect the USB cable->DB9 cable and run MSDeploy (4.3.1.0). I then select Device to 'USB' and expect "Netduino_Netduino" to be found and displayed as per the Wiki steps... but the Device name field remains empty, and Ping returns nothing. 

 

I've tried variations on this, not power cycling the Mini, changing the order of the power/connect steps etc... but have concluded that either the TineBootloaderDecompressor installation failed, or I installed the wrong TinyBootloaderDecompressor.bin file (I used this one: attachment)

 

Appreciate any further help.

 

Hello!

What method of deployment to yours are you using? I prefer TTL so I flashed that one. Then it becomes why did you chose USB as deployment method? Ideally you should choose serial instead.

 

Incidentally are you also using the right version deployment tool?

 

The Wiki pages do not reflect the fact that there are (at the time it was written) three Netduino designs, the Mini, the regular Netduino, and the Plus.

 

Do me a favor, would you, and please try again with the settings for serial. And chose your delivered files carefully.



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#6 kiwi65

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Posted 14 April 2015 - 12:40 AM

Yes, I prefer TTL and configured the Mini this way when I first opened the box and powered up. To get 4.2 flashed I needed RS232, so I purchased a USB->DB9 cable+adapter+breakout and have successfully used this to get the TinyBootloaderDecompressor.bin file loaded.

 

Question on that.... I used the TinyBootloaderDecompressor.bin file from Chris's post/attachment here. Is that the same one you used?

 

I have been using version 4.3.1 of the deployment tool. You were right to ask if I was using the correct version.... so I went looking for MFDeploy 4.2.x. I no longer had NetMF 4.2 loaded, so re-installed that (and re-installed VS2010 first because it was asked for!) and use MFDeploy 4.2.0.0 for the steps in the wiki. I selected COM7 (the one used for SAM-BA). Result is below.

 

 
Connecting to COM7...Connected
Pinging... NoConnection

 

Edit: I also tried disconnecting my RS232, and used my USB->TTL adapter (on pins 11 and 12). I ran both versions of MSDeploy and had the same ping response as above (on COM4).

 

I'm really burning on this. Lots of careful diagnostic steps trying to work out what's wrong ... and I'm still stuck. Starting to think that I really am an idiot (ie my 'friends' have been right all along...)

 

Thanks in advance for your help!


#7 kiwi65

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Posted 17 April 2015 - 04:40 AM

Ok, some progress but still nowhere near having the Mini successfully flashed to 4.2.0.1

 

I've learned that using SAM-BA to load the 4.2.0.1 (RS232) TinyBootloaderDecompressor.bin leaves the Mini unresponsive to MFDeploy (I'me using 4.2 now... to cut down the number of diagnostic permutations)

 

So I SAM-BA'ed the 4.2.0.1 TTL version, wired up my USB->Serial(TTL) cable and fired up MFDeploy, pinged and HOLY COW I got a response. Once the weeping for joy subsided I pinged again and, alas, that sinking feeling returned. Back to the drawing board. 

 

Can anyone make sense of the MFDeploy log below?

 

Test 1; Immediate ping

Setup: USB->TTL Pins TX 11,RX 12, and GND to 23, +5v to 21

Method: Plug in USB-TTL (powers up Mini), Switch on Timestamping, Select COM4, hit ping immediately and then keep hitting ping

[12:31:06 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:11 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:15 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:18 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... TinyBooter

[12:31:20 p.m. 17/04/2015] Bootloader build info: Netduino Mini (v4.2.0.1) by Secret Labs LLC

[12:31:23 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:26 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:29 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:31 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:36 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:39 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

[12:31:42 p.m. 17/04/2015] Pinging... Error: No response from device

 

 

I consistently get this response sequence. Delaying the first ping until 10 seconds after power up results in never getting a TinyBooter message, ie 100% 'Error: No response from device'.

 

Attempting to deploy the ER_FLASH file (immediately after the successful TinyBooter log entry show up) returns 'Error: No response from device' in 100% of cases. 

 

Can anyone (Chris....?!?) shed some light on this? Or alternatively  just sell me a bunch of already-upgraded Netduino Mini's :)


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