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#1 mcinnes01

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 12:00 PM

Hi, I am thinking of upgrading to windows 8 but from having a little search and using the upgrade utility I am still non the wiser as to whether or not I will run in to issues when trying to develop my netduino applications. I have VS2010 Pro install on my x64 windows 7 machine and this with SP1 is one of the few things the win8 upgrade facility flagged as being incompatible. Looking on the VS2010 site it doesn't mention it is compatible with windows 8 so I'm really not sure? I guess they are trying to push us towards VS2012 right? I can get vs2012 pro thats no problem but if I go this route will I have issues with NETMF and netduino SDK? Thanks, Andy PS some people are saying use VM which is supposed to be good in Win8 but is that really the best solution?

#2 Mario Vernari

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 02:52 PM

Hello Andy. My suspect is about the .Net version, which is 4.5 on Win 8, while VS2010 can't handle it. I'm using VS2012 Ultimate at work, and it seems decent. I say "decent" because it's clearly *less* stable than VS2010, especially when working with XAML sources. Often the IDE hangs, and you must close a service via Task Manager. BTW, VS2012 is the very only way to work with C#5 and .Net 4.5, so if you're looking for async-await-ing your life, if you must switch. Please, bear in mind that VS2012 does *NOT* handle apps targeting XP. In other words, if you want your app running on XP, you must avoid C#5/.Net 4.5, and keep VS2010 alive. That's what I'm doing. Regarding Win 8, I'm still suspicious. Win 7 is very good, IMHO, both x86 and x64 work perfectly. I'm using desktop PCs, and the software we're creating should run on desktops. Tablets (pills?) are something new, and our Customers are pretty lazy on new techs. I really could not develop on a tablet PC, nor playing with my Netduino. So, why switching to Win 8, and not keeping Win 7 for a bit longer? I totally agree: they must push something new, and Win 8, VS2012, etc are the new toys... I'd wait a little bit before something we still don't know... Hope it helps. Cheers
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#3 mcinnes01

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 04:10 PM

Yes at work I use VS2010 too, but I am more and more in need of the await function of 4.5. At the moment I am working on implementing a fully service orientated architecture for all database interaction with all my apps, desktop and web based. Web API is clearly something that functions better with the async capabilities of functions like await. That being said I have just bought another VS2010 Pro + MDSN licence at work and am in the process of setting up TFS 2010. I have no use or interest in supporting XP, and tbh most things I am doing now are aimed at being web apps using HTML5 with data visualisation from things like Telerik UI toolbox. I did play with the beta preview of VS2012 and also noticed it was a little glitchy, however my new development machine at work that has been up and running for less than 2 weeks with VS2010 on isn't much better either. I can open VS but when I open a project or solution, VS closes with no error log on the error viewer? This being said, I am eager to get win8 at home but have the catch 22 of VS2010 not being supported, and VS2012 not supporting NETMF 4.2. Is the answer using hyper-V for now I wonder?

#4 Chris Walker

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Posted 27 October 2012 - 04:38 PM

I'm currently using VS2010 and the .NET MF 4.2 SDK on Windows 8. I've also been using VS2012 and the .NET MF 4.3 beta SDK on Windows 8 without any issue. We should have a Netduino SDK update for VS2012 in early November as well. Chris

#5 AlfredBr

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 12:37 AM

I'm running Windows8 and VS2010 for WinForms development and also with .NETMF 4.2 with no issues.

#6 mcinnes01

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Posted 28 October 2012 - 09:32 AM

Cool, I am upgrading then. Thanks everyone!

#7 MaYHeM

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 09:43 PM

I say "decent" because it's clearly *less* stable than VS2010, especially when working with XAML sources. Often the IDE hangs, and you must close a service via Task Manager.


Nonsense. I now use VS2012 almost exclusively where possible. The stability and performance is leaps and bounds over 2010.
2010 Designer would hang on XAML plenty, it's the toolbox. I suggest if patience was applied the toolbox would complete it's load after a few minutes, with no need to kill the process. I also suggest that it would be worthwhile effort to investigate your currently installed extensions to ensure one of them is not the culprit.

The only thing holding me back going 100% VS2012 in my personal work, is .NET MF with Netduino.

Any further word on that SDK for 4.3 beta? Perhaps I should ask in the 4.3beta thread. ;)

#8 Mario Vernari

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 04:27 AM

Nonsense. I now use VS2012 almost exclusively where possible. The stability and performance is leaps and bounds over 2010.
2010 Designer would hang on XAML plenty, it's the toolbox. I suggest if patience was applied the toolbox would complete it's load after a few minutes, with no need to kill the process. I also suggest that it would be worthwhile effort to investigate your currently installed extensions to ensure one of them is not the culprit.

The only thing holding me back going 100% VS2012 in my personal work, is .NET MF with Netduino.

Any further word on that SDK for 4.3 beta? Perhaps I should ask in the 4.3beta thread. ;)


Nonsense?
http://connect.micro...e-not-returning

I never use toolbox, nor the visual designer, but the raw xaml instead all the times. The hang often happens when you close a tab containing xaml, or also when you close the whole IDE having some xaml panes.

However, I switched to Win 8 Pro here at home. Despite some limitation, seems working fine. Major troubles are with old apps (VB6), and unsigned drivers which are not more allowed (unless a tricky procedure).
Cheers
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#9 MaYHeM

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 01:00 PM

I do not doubt you've experienced what you say. What I'm driving at is the claim 2012 is less stable than 2010 is inaccurate. 2010 experiences similar issues and many many more.

#10 Mario Vernari

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 03:35 PM

I do not doubt you've experienced what you say. What I'm driving at is the claim 2012 is less stable than 2010 is inaccurate. 2010 experiences similar issues and many many more.


Perhaps the longer usage, yet the many patches to the 2010, but *at the moment* the 2010 yields almost *NO* bugs, while 2012 does.
I believe it's normal for a new product.
Cheers
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#11 MaYHeM

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 05:30 PM

We'll just have to disagree. 2010 has many bugs, as does any application of the size and scope of Visual Studio. One such bug includes similar behavior to what you have reported experiencing in VS2012 (which btw is the toolbox and designer, regardless of the fact you are writing raw XAML, the designer still updates in the background). However, 2012 includes many bug *fixes*, resolving open issues within 2010. Enjoy the rest of your week!

#12 Chris Walker

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 09:02 AM

Hi MaYHeM,

Any further word on that SDK for 4.3 beta? Perhaps I should ask in the 4.3beta thread. ;)

I'm using Visual Studio 2012 Express for Windows Desktop and the .NET Micro Framework 4.3 SDK exclusively on my main laptop at the moment. .NET MF 4.3 is getting closer and closer to release quality every day.

We'll post an update once it's ready to go. Hopefully soon; VS2012 is indeed very nice.

Chris

#13 SirPoonga

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 05:07 PM

Quick question. Is the problem of a VS2010 Netduino project not seeing the Netduino in the Device dropdown with the NEtduino or Windows 8? In other words do I have to wait for some update to the tools to support Windows 8 or is it a firmware update to the Netduino so I have to go find a Windows 7 machine to update the firmware?

#14 Chris Walker

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 05:28 PM

Hi SirPoonga,

Quick question. Is the problem of a VS2010 Netduino project not seeing the Netduino in the Device dropdown with the NEtduino or Windows 8? In other words do I have to wait for some update to the tools to support Windows 8 or is it a firmware update to the Netduino so I have to go find a Windows 7 machine to update the firmware?

I'm guessing that it's more likely a driver mismatch.

Try uninstalling your current NETMF 4.2 and Netduino SDKs, and then installing the latest 4.2 SDKs from the downloads page.

If you had an older version of either of those installed, then Netduinos based on the 4.2 QFE2 codebase won't appear.

Chris

#15 SirPoonga

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 08:41 PM

Brand new install of Windows 8 and I used the downloads from the downloads page. Let's start at the device manager. Where and what would the Netduino look like under the device manager? I believe I have an old Netduino Plus. What else is there other than QFE2? The downloads page and plus forum link to QFE2.

#16 Chris Walker

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 11:41 PM

Hi SirPoonga,

Let's start at the device manager. Where and what would the Netduino look like under the device manager?

Netduino Plus (gen1), if the drivers are installed, will appear under the "USB" entries. If no drivers are installed, it'll be visible when you first open Device Manager...with an exclamation mark over its icon. If it has been erased, it'll appear in Ports as "GPS COM PORT" or "Atmel devboard (COMx)" or something along those lines.

I believe I have an old Netduino Plus. What else is there other than QFE2? The downloads page and plus forum link to QFE2.

If your board's silkscreen says "Netduino Plus", then you have one of the gen1 boards. .NET MF 4.2 QFE2 is what you want...it'll work with all the boards.

Chris

#17 SirPoonga

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 05:19 AM

Then I have a gen 1 and something is wrong. I installed Win7 on another computer. I tried QFE1 and QFE2 (uninstalled QFE1 first). MFDeploy is not seeing the netduino. I have XP on an old laptop I could try, but I have a feeling something is wrong with my netduino now. I don't see anything in device manager. No unknowns, nothing new shows up in the USB tree (even after a rescan).

#18 Chris Walker

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 01:19 AM

Hi SirPoonga,

I don't see anything in device manager. No unknowns, nothing new shows up in the USB tree (even after a rescan).

When you attach and detach the Netduino Plus from your PC, does Device Manager rescan?

Have you tried another Micro USB cable?

Finally...if the blue LED never goes off, that means that your board is either erased or damaged. If erased, it should show up a serial port or unknown device.

Chris

#19 SirPoonga

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 04:21 AM

Oh man, I had to dig around to find another cable. Found one, it worked. Doh.




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